Won't Start -- Engine Will Not Turn

[khazouri]

So, I went out this morning to start her up like any other Monday, and she turned for one instant and then never turned again. The starter will not turn now. When I turn the key, I hear the fuel pump charge and I do not get the CHEC message on the dash, so does this mean I can rule out the kickstand switch? If it's the battery, can I expect the solenoid clicking sound that you get from a car, or is this symptomatic of the battery being low on juice (I've since put the charger on). The lights come on and don't look dim.

I started to go get at the motor to tap on it a bit, but that's major surgery, inasmuch as there's a good bit of tupperware and airbox removal required. So I've decided to drive the van to work today and work on this tonite. Any ideas you have would be much appreciated.

[Scootereno]

The kill switch or the brake switch can still be in play here. Try using the opposite brake lever when starting it. Otherwise it might be a fuse, starter or battery.

[ray nielsen]

A weak battery often causes the starter solenoid to chatter, but a really dead battery doesn't even do that. Do the instrument lights stay on when the starter button is pushed? If so, you don't have a dead battery, but if they go out the battery is suspect.

You might check the tightness of the battery terminals -- I prefer a 10mm socket wrench to a Phillips screwdriver to make sure they're tight. The kill switch on the handlebars might be the culprit too, if you bumped it during start up.

Good luck.

Ray Nielsen,in Minneapolis and going for a ride today -- it's supposed to reach 50 degrees!

[khazouri]

Yeah, I tried both break handles and flipping the kill switch multiple times. As stated previously, the lights seem pretty bright, indicating a healthy battery, but I'll know more after it's been charged and I get home to mess with it. If it is either the kill switch or the kickstand switch, would you still get the fuel pump charging? If NOT, then that would rule out either of those (I DO hear the fuel pump) and then it's on to, you know, saying a prayer and rapping on the starter a couple of times with a hammer after dissasembling half the bike.

[Ralph M]

If it's the kill switch or side stand switch the pump wont run.

[khazouri]

So, as it would happen the manual has a very nice diagnostic procedure for this issue. You'll have to forgive me, I came from Chinese scooter land, in which there are no written procedures.

Looks like I will need to aquire a volt ohm meter and check all of this out. I do have one question apropos of the starter relay check. The manual says not to apply battery power to the relay for longer than five seconds. Does that mean don't hook it up to the battery for any longer than that, or don't perform the actual continuity check for longer than five seonds? I think the circuit is not completed and voltage not applied till you actually cross the terminals and listen for the click, but I want to make sure.

The manual says to check the starter relay, then the kickstand and safety relays. I've already ruled out the kickstand and kill switches because I get fuel pump action when I trip those. So right now, I'm thinking it's the starter relay. Of course, I will check fuses for grins before I do anything else.

This is the first non-routine maintenance issue I've had with this bike since I got it. It has about 15k miles on it and I've had it for over two yeras now, so not too bad. I may check the fuses tonite, but I'm so frustrated from taking of the tupperware that I may just call it quits.

Lemme know on that relay check question and stay tuned. Thanx for all of the help.

[InfernoST]

Don't forget to check the actual starter switch on the right hand control it has known to go bad. I just got done replacing my right hand control on my 08 400 because the internal switch mechanism melted and could no longer be repaired.

[Calyx]

I had exactly the same problem on my 2004-400. After messing up with electrics I managed to get a FI fault.
Turns out "fuel relay sender thingy" was badly corroded. Changed that thing (£17) and gave the wiring harness a good clean. Fired up straight away. No it didn't fire up straightaway I had to reset the electronics controller unit first as it was giving an error called "crank timing is buggered".

I think the problem is; if spark plug can't receive fuel, starter motor just doesn't turn over.

[khazouri]

I aquired a VO meter and did the check of the starter relay, per the manual. I was not sure if I was supposed to apply the needles to the contacts inside the relay, or to the contacts in the wiring harness, so I just did both and got no voltage in either case when the starter button was pushed. Voltage to the relay is 12v dead on, so that's good. Operating the kickstand switch and the kill switch both gimme clicks and fuel charging, so I am leaning toward the starter button, saftey relay or sidestand relay. My questions are as follows:

1. If I get sidestand switch operation (clicks and fuel charging), can I assume that the sidestand relay is operating?
2. Are there any other fuses I should check? I checked the two on the starter relay and all the fuses in the fuse box. They're all fine.
3. So, how do you get to the starter button? Do I need to detach the throttle cables from the plastic spindle? They look like they just push out, but they're not pushing out easily and I don't want to apply too much pressure and break the plastic.

Calyx, I'm not sure what you're talking about. I searched the manual for fuel relay and nothing came up, so I'm not sure what part your talking about.

[khazouri]

Update: I got her to start up this morning. I loosened the throttle return line which allowed me to crack open the switch panel. I blew on it real good and that got it to work, so now it's just a matter of taking it fully apart to clean the contacts real good. Lots of little parts for my fat fingers, very frustrating. The things we do for love...

[InfernoST]

So it was the starter switch?

[Calyx]

Calyx, I'm not sure what you're talking about. I searched the manual for fuel relay and nothing came up, so I'm not sure what part your talking about.

It is in page 4-41.

Looks like you solved the problem quite easily.
Now all you need is cotton buds and a compressed air can.(maybe a cheapo tooth brush as well) I would give it a good wd40 after cleaning all the gunk.

[khazouri]

Yes, it was the starter button. I just cleaned all the gunk out; the actual contacts themselves looked ok. Its odd that anything could be in there, but there sure was a lot of what looked like cobwebs, but was probably some kind of mold.