DR Pulley sliders - what weight should I use? - Page 2 - Suzuki Burgman Forum
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post #11 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-24-2017, 10:18 AM
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Originally Posted by sirkitrider-2 View Post
""Sheave wear in the variator and torque multiplier will have a large effect on transmission behavior. I had 20gm sliders in for about 40K with sheaves of varying (and slightly deteriorating) condition and found the sliders worked well.""

What is/are the sheave you speak of?? Is the face of the variator? Different terminology that I've heard b4.

Sirkitrider
Sheaves are the 'pulleys' that the V-belt rides in. The term can refer to either the variator or the torque multiplier which is why I used the term sheave. From experience, I would replace both assemblies when rebuilding the transmission as it is extraordinarily unlikely for just one to be worn.

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post #12 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-24-2017, 10:28 AM
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""I figure if I do then I'm committed to riding the burg to 130-150K""

130-150K, as in thousand? Boy I LOVE my Burgmans .... I have a 400 and a 650. But 130-150K for the 400 seems overly optimistic if not unreasonable. To me. IMO. YMMV

Sirkitrider
Well, I'm at around 88K now and still on the original clutch (which at last inspection had nearly undetectable wear when compared with a shiny new clutch). What would you expect to fail? As long as you're willing to keep replacing the various wear-parts (tires, pads, sheaves, belts and the odd bearing here and there) and change the oil, I don't know what I would expect go south in the engine. I use a little oil but that has been pretty much consistent for the past 60K or so. I'm not hearing any worrisome noises. I expect that when it goes, it's going to be sudden, amazing, and terminal.

Then again, I would be unhappy if I didn't get 300K+ out of my cars so I may have unreasonable expectations.

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Last edited by Chatman128; 01-24-2017 at 10:31 AM.
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post #13 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-24-2017, 12:56 PM
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Thanks Chatman128,

I was just familiar with the variator, or variator face term, as it relates to possible grooves ... sheave and torque multiplier are new terms for me. I'll put them in my lexicon

Sirkitrider

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post #14 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-24-2017, 01:10 PM
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Torque multiplier is the rear section (driven) of the trans. The variator is the drive portion. They both have sheaves.

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post #15 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-24-2017, 01:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Chatman128 View Post
Well, I'm at around 88K ...
Chatman128, Good to hear you have so many miles on your 400! I've seen a few, 2-3, on here with 100K. I can seen 75-100K, but it seems to me that much over 100K is an outlier for that one cylinder thumper .... even as great as it is. So, yes all things are replaceable. But IF that engine implodes, at whatever mileage, it would surely be cost prohibitive to repair and continue on. Modern engines are great .... my 02 Trailblazer has 193K, and the wife's 05 Highlander has 195K. They keep on trucking, hopefully for another 100K.
Here's to you reaching that goal of 130-15-K. Keep us posted.

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post #16 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-24-2017, 10:02 PM
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I would appreciate if you could post your RPM VS Speeds chart in this discussion thread, instead of simply referencing it, making us have to go search for it. Or you could put a link to the RPM VS Speeds, in your post. Thanks.
Cheers!
Guess I figured if important enough -- folks would look it up.
That said, I had a heck of a time finding it -- finally did by using the GOOGLE Search Box.

Here is link I had when I found the topic.

Test Ride new CVT Belt and Sliders (from recent install post)

Copied and Pasted from the above link. (Say again -- 19GM Sliders and new belt put in at same time) .

Burgman Acceleration and Speed test Today (Sunday) at 39F Degrees:

Some Opinions & some Facts (The MPH vs RPM Pictures are Fact, rest are Opinions).

Opinions:

Low speed acceleration Zero MPH up to 60MPH is better than before the new Belt and using Sliders vs Rollers gives lower gearing as advertiswed by DR Pulley. I am pretty sure, but not precise measurments now and none before -- I counted 1001, 1002, 1003, etc. -- I say around 7 seconds, could be 8 seconds to 65MPH INDICATED - I did it three times at Full Throttle (Car Tire on Rear take 7% off indicated to get actual). As I said - Lower gearing as advertised by Dr Pulley.

Higher speed acceleration from 50 or 60 MPH up to 70 MPH INDICATED is plenty satisfactory. From 70 MPH to 80 or 90 MPH takes a little while, don't try passing in a short distance. I think about like it was before Belt and Slider replaced the Rollers. Maybe a bit less acceleration based on fact higher speeds give higher gearing as advertised by Dr Pulley. Not a Burgman 650, but adequate.

Top speed is not much over 95 MPH INDICATED (Car Tire on Rear take 7% off indicated to get actual). It takes some time to get from 75 to 95 MPH INDICATED. I think that is about the same as before. However, before I could hit red line of 9000 RPM before, I don't think it will now (probably due to higher gearing with the Sliders vs rollers). Higher gearing at high speed as advertised by Dr Pulley

Facts: NOTE: Pictures of dash do not show here on this Copy and Paste, they do show if you call up the topic using the link above.

Dash RPM and MPH pictures pretty well show how MPH and RPMs are related under full throttle acceleration. NOTE: As I said before, I don't think the Scooter will REV to 9000 RPM (Red Line) anymore. I guess the Sliders are producing higher gearing - obvious in that the RPM are lower at each speed over 50 MPH than they use to be.

Start at 50 MPH at 5000 RPM and go Full Throttle. No picturre I noted RPM jumps to 6000 / 6200 RPM pretty quickly and then falls back a little before building up again.

Picture 1 65 MPH at 5600 RPM

Picture 2 73 MPH at 6100 RPM

Picture 3 80 MPH at 7250 RPM

Picture 4 95 MPH at 7700 RPM (ran out of road, but I think that was about all the Ol Gal would do)
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post #17 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-24-2017, 11:23 PM
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I looks like just about what I had expected. With the 16 gm sliders vs the 19 gm sliders, the 16 give about 200 rpm more through the cruising speeds, at higher speeds, like about 80, it's 600 rpm more. Then at top speed, you were indicating 95 mph at 7,700 rpm, but with the 16 gm sliders I was getting 100 mph at 8,500 rpm, right at the redline.

In summary, the 16 gm sliders are giving a little more rpm, in what I think is the perfect "Power Zone" for that engine, allowing it to reach Top Speed at the Redline, with maximum performance, while still allowing allowable rpms for normal riding and cruising speeds with slightly better acceleration. Acceleration in mid range punch at about 50 mph is 6,800 rpm, which puts the engine in a good power range for maximum acceleration.

Al in Sunny Tampa Bay Florida (St Petersburg)
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post #18 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-24-2017, 11:47 PM
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Speedometer error effects.

Seems I was about 10% off with MC Tire (reads high, take 10% off).

More like 7% off with Car Tire that is 155 70 13 (reads high, take 7% off).

100 MPH less 10% is 90MPH

95 MPH less 7% is 88.3MPH

Depending on how accurate all that is and if it will do it, not much difference.

Anyway, I don't go at 90 or 100 mph (maybe once in a blue moon for fun)

Cruises OK at 70 MPH indicated and can shoot it up to pass (need room). Most of my riding is 30 to 55 mph (traffic and back roads). Probably, anything from 16GM to 19GM for my riding and ride area (East TN hills, curves, etc.) would work.
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post #19 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-25-2017, 04:19 PM
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I'd stick with the OEM weights and just make sure everything is clean inside.

When I owned my 400, I was a tester for Dr. Pulley and their products. I swore by them. But if I was coming back to a Burgman 400, I think I'd keep the OEM weights...and only if I was replacing the clutch, would I go for the Dr. Pulley HiT clutch. (It was nice, but expensive.)

When I did a SS1000 on my 400, I was using 18g DPS weights. I thought they'd be great for the ride. They weren't. When commuting in Seattle, the DPS weights kept the RPMs down to a nice relaxing number at 60 mph. But when I was on the SS1000, the speeds went up and exposed what I think is a weakness of the DPS weights.

There was a point where I was going up a slight hill at 75 mph and I gave the bike some more gas. It was maxed out. My suspicion is that the engine couldn't get into it's max horsepower and torque rpms as it fought against the incline of the hill, and the wind resistance. Yet with OEM weights, I'd had the bike at somewhere over 90 mph and it was still accelerating.

While it may seem like the engine is working too hard with the OEM weights, it is designed for it.

Chris

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post #20 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-25-2017, 05:51 PM
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Yeah, I like my 16 gram sliders, they are perfect for me, they keep me right in the speed and power range I like to be, haulin A$$!

Al in Sunny Tampa Bay Florida (St Petersburg)
2006 Burgman AN650 K6 White (The White Knight)
2008 Burgman AN400 K8 Red (The Red Baron)
1977 Honda CB 750 Silver
1977 Penneys 50 Moped Red
1974 Yamaha 360 MX Yellow
1973 Yamaha 80 MX Silver
1972 Honda QA 50 Red
1971 Kaw Bighorn 350 Enduro Brown
1970 Kaw H1 500 Red
1968 Kaw 120 Scrambler Red
1968 Kaw 120 Scrambler Blue
As far as the cages go, I've had all kinds,
but Toyota's Rule, no doubt!
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